Centurion 530 worklog

[playafly187]

In preparation for a DangerDen watercooling kit I will be reviewing soon, I found myself in need of a new case. My current Praetorian would be a great choice, but the dual 120mm radiator simply will not fit in the case without looking cluttered. I thought about using a Silverstone TJ05, but the water kit will have a dual bay res, and the TJ05 has a door.

XPTB recently reviewed the Centurion, so I checked with him to see if the kit would work in that case. He brought it down and I gave it a quick inspection. Score!

There will be plenty of room to mount the radiator in the base of the case. But, not without some serious modifications. First up, we have a shot of the case fresh out of the shipping box.

http://www.ocia.net/reviews/centurion/pic13.jpg

My goal is to mount the radiator on the floor of the case, near the front. This of course means that the hard drive cage must go. Simple enough, just remove four screws.

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p1.jpg

The radiator with fans mounted will be around 2 1/2" inches tall, so there will be a minimal amount of clearance between the fans and the floppy / hdd rack. So, I removed that as well. This was easy as well, just drill out some rivets. I plan to mount my hard drive in one of the 5 1/2" optical bays anyway, so losing this rack was not a problem.

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p5.jpg

Ahh, plenty of room for the radiator and fans now.

I also went ahead and broke out the remaining two optical drive covers and the floppy cover.

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p6.jpg

[playafly187]

Next up, the front intake grill. Im not too fond of these built in stamped grills, and I dont see why case manufacturers still use them. Just leave a wide open hole and let us put in our own fan grills!

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p3.jpg

and after...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p4.jpg

Yes, I know my dremel skills suck, but hey, this is like my second time using one for a big project...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p7.jpg

much better...

[playafly187]

The next thing to go is the rear 120mm fan grill.

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p15.jpg

then...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p8.jpg

[playafly187]

While planning out this entire case mod, I kept falling back to the same question: How am I going to raise the case up enough to give proper ventilation to the radiator? While digging though one of my spare parts drawers, I found my answer... caster wheels! I had a set of these wheels that came with the 3-drawer set but I never installed them. This would be the perfect addition to the Centurion, but how would I install the wheels?

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p9.jpg

This is what the two rear feet on the Centurion look like. Here is a full shot of the bottom from XPTB's review.

http://www.ocia.net/reviews/centurion/pic25.jpg

As you can see, only two feet are included, but there are holes for two more. The front bezel acts as the front supports so these feet are not needed.

After some thought, I finally came up with an idea. Push out the support pin in the rear feet, bore out the hole a little bigger, and insert the wheel.

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p11.jpg

Genius! I borrowed two feet from an old Lian Li case to put in the front. The wheels fit in the bored out holes very tightly, which is a good thing. So, will this even really help?

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p13.jpg

Id say. Plenty of clearance now...

[playafly187]

of course, nothing can go right for me... im in the middle of some more cutting and POP, the dremel dies. what makes it worse is that it is the top of the line expensive dremel. what makes it just horrible is that it isnt even mine!

[FunkZ]

Man, that bites. Was looking good too. Any chance it's still under warranty?

[tobb555]

cant wait to see it when its done

[playafly187]

Man, that bites. Was looking good too. Any chance it's still under warranty?

i doubt it, Lowe's has a lame return policy. Ill probably just have to pick up a new one at Home Depot, finish up the job and send it back with XPTB. Just my luck... :oops:

[FunkZ]

i doubt it, Lowe's has a lame return policy

I thought they had a 90 day return policy?

I think the wheels are a great idea.

[playafly187]

yeah, but you need your receipt.. heh

[FunkZ]

Can you go buy a new one, wait a few days and then return the old one with the new receipt? Then you'll get a replacement for XPTB and one for yourself!

[playafly187]

haha, yeah i could i suppose lol :lol:

[playafly187]

UPDATE: watercooling kit just arrived :mrgreen:

[wedant01]

wehay. iv noticed that WATER COOLING is becoming popular. i wounder if thats because... :roll: i dont know lol

[playafly187]

Not having a real dremel to work with today (I have a cheapo cordless but it can't really do any serious cutting), I did the photo shoot for the review and decided where I was going to place everything.

http://ocia.net/playafly187/plan.jpg

Thoughts?

[FunkZ]

I like the washrag mod. :mrgreen: Is that for when it springs a leak?

In case of emergency break tape.

[playafly187]

hehe, not quite. i had that taped up there to prevent any metal shavings from making their way up into the top-mounted control area (front IO ports, power, reset and leds).

[FunkZ]

I'm pretty much a noob when it comes to water cooling, but it looks like you've got a decent rad there. Where are the lines going that exit the case? chiller?

[playafly187]

?

there are no lines that exit the case. the tubes at the bottom connect to the radiator...

[FunkZ]

Ah, nevermind me. Guess I looked too quickly at that diagram. I was thinking you were using a submersible pump in the res, but there it is, clearly labeled.

[playafly187]

back to work again today with a new dremel in hand... pics to come soon :)

[FunkZ]

Try not to blow anything up. :wink:

[playafly187]

ac on high, frequent breaks and a better cutting strategy are working well, dremel is barely getting warm now 8)

[Bio-Hazard]

Not the best idea to have the pump pulling water up to it. It's always better to have the pump as close to the rez as possible and the rez slightly above the pump for better feed to the pump.

Just a little suggestion............ :wink:

http://members.lycos.co.uk/sbrehm72255/hpbimg/DSC01884.JPG

[wedant01]

hmmm 8)

[playafly187]

The pump, where it is in the diagram, would be pulling from the bay res. is it still a bad idea, even if its pulling only about 4 inches?

also, how does the loop look? any suggestions for better performance?

[Bio-Hazard]

With the pump pulling you always stand a chance of the pump stalling due to a large air pocket and it also causes the pump to work harded thus less performance. If you notice a differance in temps or not is a big question but it's not optimum from everything I learned. The more free flow the system, the more performance you will get out of the system.

[Bio-Hazard]

What type of pump are you using, if it's one of the 12v Laing/Danger Den types, you should have it below the rez because if it does get a air pocket and goes without water for any peroid of time, it could and more than likely will destroy the pump. They will not run dry.

[playafly187]

the pump is the new d5 from danger den. perhaps i should consider moving it then. but, i dont really see how i will be able to get it level with the res. would it be bad for it to be in the base of the case? i cant exactly move the bay res anywhere heheh

[playafly187]

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p17.jpg

cut out a nice area behind the mobo. this will give me plenty of room to run wires and make the case nice and tidy.

more to come...

[FunkZ]

cut out a nice area behind the mobo

[smilie=new_shocked.gif] Wow, I'll say. Is that entirely safe with no center support for the motherboard? I guess going with watercooling you won't have a big heavy heatsink to worry about putting strain on the board, but what about inserting memory and cards?

[playafly187]

just gotta remember to be extra careful. only a single support is missing, so its not as bad as it looks. i only have an agp card, no pci cards, so no biggie there. ram is already inserted and ill install the cpu block before putting the board in the case.

[playafly187]

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p18.jpg

cut a small notch here so i can route the psu wires directly behind the board

btw, the scratches are from sanding, not the dremel

[Bio-Hazard]

The base of the case for the pump would be perfect........ 8)

[playafly187]

hrm, then the base it is :lol:

[playafly187]

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p19.jpg

got the two holes cut out for the fans. cutting circles is pretty tough with a dremel lol

[tobb555]

thats lookin great

[Bio-Hazard]

You're coming right along pretty fast with the mod, at this rate, you'll be done in a week............ :wink:

[playafly187]

hehe, im hoping to get the kit in the case and have water running tonight... doubt its gonna happen tho lol

[playafly187]

success...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p20.jpg

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p21.jpg

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p23.jpg

running leak tests now. had a small leak when i first turn it on; i had overtightened one of the fittings on the radiator and the rubber seal was pushed out. fixed that and its running like a champ now...

[silenze]

Lookin' great :twisted:

[fstroupe]

wehay. iv noticed that WATER COOLING is becoming popular. i wounder if thats because... :roll: i dont know lol

Mainly because the manufacturers are coming out with easier to use kits, and in-case radiators...in the past you pretty much had to piece stuff together yourself, make your own parts, and the radiators were seperate....really a pain going to a LAN trying to carry a case and radiator at the same time without causing leaks. The prices are coming down too.

[Bio-Hazard]

That's some pretty fast modding, you should be up and running by the end of the day.............. :wink: That is if you cut your leak test short......... :lol:

[playafly187]

question for ya bio hazard - when i initially turned on the pump, water was moving around in the res pretty strongly. then after i filled it up the rest of the way and adjusted the rheostat on the pump to 5 (as recommended by danger den), the "roughness" of the water coming into the res seemed to die down substantially.

is this normal when the system is full, to not have a 'violent' flow of water into the res?

[Bio-Hazard]

The higher the flow the more 'violent' the action of the water in the rez. I haven't used that pump yet so I don't know what the different setting do in regards to flow and noise, but to answer your first question, the water will settle down some as the air gets worked out of the system. I'm still using a original Laing D4 with 370 GPH in my system and the water really flow pretty 'violent' all the time, that's one of the reasons I have a 40 oz res, to help keep it from churning up air bubbles and foam, but after all the air is out of the system things settle down.

[wedant01]

YEAH, the PRICES!!!

how heavy is your case to lift... could you carry it up 2 flights of stairs easyilly?? (bio) lol

how thicks you tubing? it looks really thick!

[playafly187]

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p25.jpg

compare this to the above photo of the res. just seems weak to me :?:

[wedant01]

yeah, i know what you mean...

[Bio-Hazard]

What are the settings on the pump? And what happens when you turn it all the way up?

[Bio-Hazard]

The first pic is what mine normally looks like, maybe a bit more 'violent'.

But I'm pushing mine through a GPU block also so that cuts the flow down a bit more.

[playafly187]

settings are 1-5. it was on 1 default. it seems that when i changed it to 5, it slowed down.

*checks pump again*

and apparantly im an idiot. the rheostat has no arrow or anything so you dont know if its on 5 or 1.... apparantly it was on 5 to begin with and i turned it down, thinking i was doing the opposite. just cranked it back to 5, moving along nicely now...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/p24.jpg

:mrgreen:

[Bio-Hazard]

I wouldn't worry about it and just finish your leak tests and mount your system.

Messing with the setting is the best way to find out sometimes............. 8)

I looked at the pics of the pump and it is hard to tell which is the correct way for the "arrow" to point.

[FunkZ]

had a small leak when i first turn it on

I see the washrag is missing... :lol:

Lookin good, great job!

[playafly187]

think this is too much of a bend?

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/p26.jpg

[ZeroLogic]

it sorta is but just by a tiny bit

[Trunks]

Lookin good playa

[Bio-Hazard]

I'd give it a bit more tubing to take the stress off of it................ :wink:

[playafly187]

alrighty, next question... how exactly do i drain it?
*noob*

[Bio-Hazard]

That's really the hard part. If you don't have a drain/fill tube like I do, you need to disconnect a line close to the outside of the case and let the water drain into some sort of container. On mine I just open the rez and tip it to the side and let it drain, it takes a while with only one open line, but I open a second after the level is low enough not to make a mess.

[playafly187]

i drained the system by syphoning the liquid from the res, put in a longer hose, only to find out it is too long! for now, i just slid the res out of the drive bay a few inches cause im tired of fooling with it today lol

at first i wasnt all that impressed with the cooling performance. but, ive always thought this board / bios was kinda off, so i flashed to 1.8 bios (k8n neo2 platinum) and that made all the difference in the world. excellent temps and im even able to push the processor much higher than before. still havent hit the wall yet with the overclock...

for now, here are a few pics...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/c1.jpg

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/cent/c2.jpg

thoughts, comments? :D

[Bio-Hazard]

Over all I think it looks good. Some of the tubing could be shorten up maybe for a bit cleaner routing, but all and all it very workable and looks good. You've got to post your results after everything is burnt in a bit............. :twisted:

[ZeroLogic]

i have a stupid qustion but what are the spec for the rig

[playafly187]

AMD Athlon 64 (939) 3000+ @ (to be determined heh )
2x 512 MB OCZ EL Platinum PC-4800 DDR
MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum
GeForce 6800 (unlocked / overclocked ) w/ Arctic Cooling NV Silencer 5
Western Digital 74 GB Raptor 10,000 SATA
550w Aspire Chameleon PSU
CoolerMaster Centurion 530 Case
DangerDen TDX A64 Block
DangerDen D5 Pump
DangerDen Dual Bay Res.
Black Ice Extreme II Rad.

[playafly187]

Well, the system would boot and run for a while, but ultimately I was not able to get any more out of it. Still at 2700 MHz (9 x 300).

But, it is running great now, and temps are nice as well. BTW, be on the lookout for a full review by mid next week :mrgreen:

[Bio-Hazard]

I could sure use 2 of those pumps for my dual radiator/loop setup.......... 8) The original D4 are getting on my nerves. They have a pretty good whine to them............. :vomit:

[playafly187]

hehe, this d5 is very quiet, cant hear it over the rest of the system

[wedant01]

what size is your tubing?

[playafly187]

1/2" ID 3/4" OD

[playafly187]

pulled out the two Papst fans, mounted the rad to the bottom of the case, and added two 120mm uv fans on top of the rad as well as a front 120 uv fan...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/aqw.jpg

just waiting on the uv dye for the water kit now 8)

[FunkZ]

Looks awesome! That res ought to look good lit up.

You say you can't go higher than 300x9, does the Neo2 offer higher than 300 HTT? I saw one review that said 350 but most say 300 was the max.

[silenze]

I know we've both done 305x9, which is my limit.. I haven't tried going to single channel, which would probably be a little higher..

[playafly187]

yeah, 300 seems to be my limit. ive booted as high at 310 but it isnt stable and reboots or locks up randomly in windows. too bad, because im sure i could push more out of the chip.

[FunkZ]

So you do have the option of selecting up to 350 in the BIOS, but there are stability issues running it that high? I thought the NF3 Ultra was basically the same chipset as the NF4 just with AGP?

I think my Chaintech has the option for up to 400 in the BIOS but only 325 is stable enough to benchmark and it only POSTS up to 333 or so, although I haven't tried knocking the multi down to see if that's the CPU or the board, I'm pretty sure it's the CPU.

[playafly187]

yeah, without looking, im pretty sure i can run it up to 400, but anything over 300, regardless of processor speed or memory divisor, is unstable.

[silenze]

450, heh..

[playafly187]

that too :wink:

[silenze]

if I get bored later and feel like reconfiguring my bios I'll pull out a stick of ram and play around..

[FunkZ]

Is there any benefit to lower the multiplier and increase the HTT (assuming it is stable) or does that only help with AXP and FSB?

[silenze]

It's still faster just the same, though you have that, and the HT interface, but that only makes like 1% difference either way, just target around 1Ghz.. 8)

I'm about to pull a stick out and do some toying around hee...

[silenze]

I'm in single channel right now..

I tried 360x7, got a corrupted file message.. hehe.. backed down to 350x7 and here I am 8)

http://www.callatg.com/~valley1/350fsb.jpg

Edit;

Dual channel..

Never tried much over 300, hmm... too bad my ram is on the 100 divider or one HALF so yeah 170Mhz haha.. woo!

http://www.callatg.com/~valley1/340dual.jpg

Still pulls 5Gb/sec in Sandra.. hah..

[playafly187]

very nice. i tried with one stick, thinking the processor could go further. i was wrong heh. so yeah, i pretty much quit there and went back to two sticks.

interesting that you can get that much over 300 even with a divisor. mine doesnt like anything really over 300 no matter what.

[playafly187]

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/misys.jpg

been running the radiator without fans for the past week or so. works pretty well and of course is very quiet...

[ZeroLogic]

what are the temp for the cpu
is it oc?

[playafly187]

runs near 50c under full load for an extended period of time in passive mode.

overclocked 900 mhz, from 1.8 ghz to 2.7 ghz.

[Bio-Hazard]

I'm running my dual heater core setup with the fans turned off during normal use and switch them to 7 volts during gaming and OC'ing ops. But I really think that I could get away without any fans at all during gaming also................ :P

http://img151.echo.cx/img151/1198/317qc.jpg

I also just got one of these 530 cases for review............... :wink: I think I may end up water cooling my back up systen in this case, it seems to work out very well.

http://img302.echo.cx/img302/7022/371oq.jpg

[silenze]

Hey what kind of a PSU is that in the first pic ?

Nice lookin' setups.

[Bio-Hazard]

It's a Hiper 580, they just started selling them here in the US. Frozen CPU has/had them in stock last time I checked. So far it's proven to be a great unit. Rails are solid and don't move when going between idle and load. I still need to check them while overclocking though, hope to get to that this weekend.

http://www.hipergroup.com/products/hpu-4b580.html

http://www.hipergroup.com/images/products/power/hpu-4b580.jpg

[silenze]

Those modular connections are freakin' sweet! 8)

[ZeroLogic]

im jealous of you guys i wish i had those types of computers :lol:

[fstroupe]

ME TOO!!! :oops:

[playafly187]

couldnt resist posting a preview of the new UV dye I got in for review...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/uvd1.jpg

this shot was taken without any UV cathodes, just the uv led fans...

[FunkZ]

Looking good! Could you put a UV light above/below that res to make the whole thing glow?

[playafly187]

well, the res. comes with 2x 5mm holes drilled in the rear for UV leds... so I just have to get ahold of some and then it will really shine.

btw, this is just a teaser pic. i have some great shots (using 2x uv cathodes) of the entire system and the dye. review just around the corner 8)

[playafly187]

as mentioned in the last post, the bay res has some holes predrilled for uv leds... well i was going through my junk drawer and ran across this:

http://www.ocia.net/reviews/cgrills/Dscn1777.jpg

the light inside that fan grill is UV... so I split the grill in half and extracted the bare cathode. looking at the bay res, there was just enough room to slide this mini cathode in right above it...

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/uvv2.jpg

taped in place, power connected. slid the res back in place, and WOW

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/uvv1.jpg

[smilie=notworthy.gif]

[ZeroLogic]

[smilie=icon_eek.gif] [smilie=love10.gif]

[FunkZ]

Awesome, got an overall shot now with the new light in place?

[playafly187]

http://www.ocia.net/reviews/uvdye/page1.shtml

:mrgreen:

[ZeroLogic]

great review i wasnt suprise that the red wasnt "uv" i love your case im so jealous :lol:

im geussing you oced it so what did you overclock to and what were the temps?

[playafly187]

it runs at 2.7 ghz, around 42 c load temps

[playafly187]

http://www.ocia.net/playafly187/zerex.jpg

heh

[ZeroLogic]

looks like fruit punch
what happened?

[playafly187]

yeah, fruit punch, or a fruit roll-up!

added some zerex cooling additive

[ZeroLogic]

geuss your going to bleed the system? dose it still glow green in the tubes? dose it look cool in the tank thinger?

[playafly187]

review on the zerex additive to come soon ;)