SP2

[undergroundtech]

Microsoft has the full version of SP2 availible for download.
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=049C9DBE-3B8E-4F30-8245-9E368D3CDB5A&displaylang=en



Should someone decide to D/L it, please feel free to burn me a copy.
At over 266MB, I don't think I'm going to even try it on dial-up :cry:

[jurtje]

Dial up? What is dial up?

[siq]

so have they got this all worked free of bugs yet? i don't want to dl it if it isn't.

[undergroundtech]

so have they got this all worked free of bugs yet? i don't want to dl it if it isn't.

Well, its no longer in beta.....but this is M$ were talking about, its never bug free :roll:



Dial up? What is dial up?

Thats what your stuck with, when the nearest cable line is 8 miles way and your to far from the main box, to get DSL......The hardware for satellite is $650 + $40 monthly connection for something that still is to slow to play multi-player online :x

I had DSL until I moved here, its enough to make me want to move back to Richmond, VA

[KryoNexus]

i'm downloading and installing it right now. i'll let you know how it works out.

[Beemer]

I can feel your pain on dial up....thats all I have at home for the same reason as you. I am hoping that one day I can get it for cheap through our satelite. I do however have a nice gigabit connection to my desktop here at work:
http://users.marshall.edu/~bmwilliams/speed.jpg

It peaked out around 2meg per sec 8)
Finished up in about three minutes.


So, if you want me to send you a CD - just give me an address :wink:

[Trunks]

Niiicee

[undergroundtech]

It peaked out around 2meg per sec 8)
Finished up in about three minutes.


So, if you want me to send you a CD - just give me an address :wink:

I'm jealous of your work connection :(

Knutsaac offered to send me a copy by PM, but thanks for the offer :D

[silenze]

I got a lowly 454kb/sec.. :(

I'm holding off for a while... I don't trust it. :)

[fstroupe]

I got a lowly 454kb/sec.. :(

I'm holding off for a while... I don't trust it. :)

Hell, I thought I was doing good with my 254kbs. :cry: Though I linked to it from a different site, it may have been a different address.

So far, everything has gone off without a hitch. Hurrah Microsoft!

[striker777]

As long as humans continue to do the programming for computers then no software is going to be bug free.

[Beemer]

Been running sp2 on my work box for a couple days now. Havent seen any big problems or changes for that matter. Maybe they did something right???

[Bio-Hazard]

I've been using it from the first beta on........... :shock: Don't hit me, I'm a Microsoft Beta tester. The RTM build really does seem to be very stable, looks like MS took all the beta testers input and fix it.........or at least most of it.

And speaking about connection speed............I've got that crap Satellite and it sucks mose of the time. Between down load limits and outages, it's not really worth the high price. But once you have it, you might as well keep it cause the equipment cost is so high. Only reason I got it is cause my stepson had to have it and paid for half of it. Then he moved out 6 months later.

[siq]

This freaking windows security center is starting to piss me off.

[fstroupe]

I guess that if there was a few million hackers/crackers/whatever working full time to screw OS 10 and Linux, they would have to have security centers, too. But it is a PITA.

[siq]

yeah it is a pain in the ass.

i mean it's good to help the newer people deal with windows but i hate seeing it down there in my toolbar doing nothing. it's like staring at me.

:shock:

[Beemer]

yeah its kind of funny when you stop and think about it, Windows are probably the least secure things in your house. Not to mention that they are very easy to break. :wink:

[striker777]

:rimshot:

[Beemer]

:rimshot:

ROTFL ah, thats good stuff!

[siq]

slashdot had something about SP2 yesterday morning...

http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/08/17/0023206 < there we go.

[silenze]

And to make things worse..

Here's a very extensive lists of fixes you don't get unless you install service pack 2, of course, the fixes for these aren't available separately from the service pack....

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;811113

[masterspud777]

ladies and gentlemen, friends and coworkers, I will say it now, and I will believe it always... XP is crap.

I've been using Win2000 for 3 years now and never felt the urge to go to XP. Why? because XP is crap. 2000 is not perfect either, but it's much less of a headache, because XP is crap :)

PS oh, and XP is crap...

[silenze]

There has been so much controversy over which is more stable.. which is faster.. yadda... it depends on the hardware you have, but overall, XP has more potential for performance/compatibility.

In my case, XP has proven to be significantly faster all around, especially in 3D games/benchmarks.

Headache? I have my XP installs tweaked, ton of stuff disabled, etc....

One thing I like Very much about XP over 2000... remote desktop.

[silenze]

yeah it is a pain in the ass.

i mean it's good to help the newer people deal with windows but i hate seeing it down there in my toolbar doing nothing. it's like staring at me.

:shock:

If you haven't noticed yet... control panel/security center, under the "Change the way Security Center alerts me." at the lower left you can disable that systray icon.

[Beemer]

I think all that we have really proven is that Windows in general is just BROKEN:period: I have come to the conclusion that too many idiots use Windows. The makers of windows have to "hide" things (ex. after a fresh install all program and windows files are hidden) just so idiots don't mess up the system. It just makes it that much more of a hassle for people who know what they are doing. Windows came into a big dilemma though: do they lock down the security and make it to where the user has to open the ports he or she needs, or leave it open so that everything works for the idiots. I guess what I am trying to say is that if an idiot is able to get in and use it, it is inherently insecure. :roll:

[silenze]

I guess what I am trying to say is that if an idiot is able to get in and use it, it is inherently insecure. :roll:

Well yeah.. but..

A doctor could install Windows XP without updates, put it on a cable modem, and get the blaster worm and 5 other variations within a matter of minutes -- is he an idiot? No, he's just misinformed or doesn't keep up on the subject, just like the idiots you see running around blowing clouds of smoke out their exhaust cause they haven't changed their oil for 6,000 miles or complaining about sticky shifting into 2nd gear at 100,000 miles because the 30,000 mile interval for a transmission flush was ignored... Sadly it is only the educated/informed that see this perspective in any case no matter what it may be.

Not to say you're wrong -- there are lots of variables in these types of equations. Some of these variables include worthless SOB's that sit around coding viruses and trying to exploit flaws in Windows... (boy I'd love to meet one of these fags in real life..) while I'm at it, I *HATE* spammers too....

I think all that we have really proven is that Windows in general is just BROKEN:period:

This one is PERFECT, however!

Encore! :P

:lol:

If there were no idiots there would be no need for windows (that would be swell), then again, there would be a very limited population. ;)

[Beemer]

Ok I have a solution: change "idiots" to "uniformed users".

:Goes to play on the linux box:

[Beemer]

If there were no idiots there would be no need for windows (that would be swell), then again, there would be a very limited population. ;)

I am not so sure that I would be here :cry:

[silenze]

yeah ya would

[masterspud777]

:Goes to play on the linux box:

Amen, brotha. I love linux... cept for the lack of directX support, thereby nullifying all of my favorite games. There's always WineX, but I dun wanna pay a fee...

[silenze]

"Windows is my playstation, *nix is my operating system."

[T-shirt]

change "idiots" to "uniformed users".


And what uniform should these former idiots wear? :lol:

I don't know what people expected, or why the expected any thing different from SP2.
Of course when you choose to block off all the easy access "windows works with anything" handles, those programs that use them will fail. Even MS released quite a few programs, never believing they would have to lock down the OS so completely.
However to say that Linux is more secure because it's not easy enough for anyone (even the majority of computer users) with little "computer" knowledge to use is ignorant.
Linux has plenty of holes, but windows was designed for use by people who don't know, and don't care HOW the computer works, as long as it lets/helps them do their job.

[silenze]

However to say that Linux is more secure because it's not easy enough for anyone (even the majority of computer users) with little "computer" knowledge to use is ignorant.

Ignorant? More secure because it's not easy enough for everyone to use? Who is ignorant here?

A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. I shouldn't have to explain any more than that, you're obviously well educated on the subject considering you throw the word 'ignorant' around in reference to it.

Linux has plenty of holes

That is extremely vague, I expected more explanation coming from an obvious expert. ;)

[Beemer]

However to say that Linux is more secure because it's not easy enough for anyone (even the majority of computer users) with little "computer" knowledge to use is ignorant.

I didn't say that linux was more secure b/c the majority of computer users don't know how to use it, I just said that Windows was insecure b/c in order for everything to function without user intervention, they had to leave the OS open. If all users knew how to lock down their PC's they wouldn't have such a problem, or if they locked everything down and made the user open up ports as they saw fit, they wouldn't have as big a problem. As I see it though, Microsoft has to make everything work for newbies, which makes it inherently insecure.

:I am loving SUSE!:

[masterspud777]

I'd just like to throw in here that Linux may seem more secure than it actually is, simply because virus-writers would wrather write a virus for widely-used Windows than for rarely-used (comparatively) Linux. The fact that Windows leaves most everything open, and Linux doesn't, obviously is a huge contributor to the difference in these OSs' security levels, though.

I'd also like to point out that Linux is becoming more and more a reasonable substitute for Windows for a person who has very little to no computer experience/knowledge. What with GUIs, increasing harware support, and extensive documentation, it may soon be "easier" to use than Windows.

Dreaming of the day when Linux becomes the OS of the majority... :roll:

[silenze]

I'd just like to throw in here that Linux may seem more secure than it actually is, simply because virus-writers would wrather write a virus for widely-used Windows than for rarely-used (comparatively) Linux. The fact that Windows leaves most everything open, and Linux doesn't, obviously is a huge contributor to the difference in these OSs' security levels, though.

Like I said a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link, nothing is secure if not administrated properly.

I'd also like to point out that Linux is becoming more and more a reasonable substitute for Windows for a person who has very little to no computer experience/knowledge. What with GUIs, increasing harware support, and extensive documentation, it may soon be "easier" to use than Windows.

Unix/Linux used to be the operating system sought out by hardcore computer geeks that wanted control of every aspect of their system as well as the ability to customize it infinitely. Most of us who've been around for several years are disgusted by things such as Lindows and Corel linux... turning our dear operating system into a mockery of the very OS we despise for commercial profit.

I can't help but to analogize this with the Dark side and the Light side from Star Wars... Dark being unix/linux, Light being Windows of course, or perhaps that's backward, all things considered... Or maybe I need to take a break from the computer for a while... :? ... Nah..

Luke... use the source!

... k I need a vacation.

[Beemer]

I'd just like to throw in here that Linux may seem more secure than it actually is, simply because virus-writers would wrather write a virus for widely-used Windows than for rarely-used (comparatively) Linux.

Linux makes a pretty big target because there are many mission critical servers that are linux based.

[fstroupe]

Here we go: "Flaws in SP2 Security Features"

http://www.heise.de/security/artikel/50051

[T-shirt]

However to say that Linux is more secure because it's not easy enough for anyone (even the majority of computer users) with little "computer" knowledge to use is ignorant.

Ignorant? More secure because it's not easy enough for everyone to use? Who is ignorant here?

A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. I shouldn't have to explain any more than that, you're obviously well educated on the subject considering you throw the word 'ignorant' around in reference to it.

Linux has plenty of holes
That is extremely vague, I expected more explanation coming from an obvious expert. ;)
Ignorant doesn't mean stupid, it just means unaware/unschooled in or (the way I meant it) to deliberately ignore known facts.
If you are truly unaware,of this years string of attacks on Linux :roll: I can't begin to explain them to you.
If you're just ignoring them, that is your choice.
As several European governments switch to Linux platforms, I believe attacks will greatly increase, and the true cost and vulnerability s will become more obvious.
I don't hate Linux (in fact the competition will be very good for MS users price wise as well as forcing MS to deal with some long term problems) however it doesn't make it a panacea.
The challenges (IMHO) Linux faces are
fragmentation- too many proprietary versions which is sure to get worse as branded try to distinguish themselves
Support- cheap/free versions have none,proprietary versions have some but costs will eat them up, and some will end up with abandoned/no longer supported versions.
Cost- often promoted as free, all open-source project must begin to deal with the fact that all of the above mean presenting a viable commercial product is expensive and
support and somehow those costs must be accounted for and payed.

[T-shirt]

Here we go: "Flaws in SP2 Security Features"

http://www.heise.de/security/artikel/50051
Again not a big suprise
Think of Windows as the deluxe swiss army knife, a tool for everything added here and there.
Now you have a piece of tough steak, but the forks on one end and the knife is one the other. you may need a third-party tool to make it work without getting your hands dirty.

[masterspud777]

I'd just like to throw in here that Linux may seem more secure than it actually is, simply because virus-writers would wrather write a virus for widely-used Windows than for rarely-used (comparatively) Linux.

Linux makes a pretty big target because there are many mission critical servers that are linux based.

That is true, no doubt. It would seem reasonable, however, that if someone were going to have a mission critical server at all, they would be sure to put it behind firewalls/virus checkers/etc....

It also seems reasonable to say that the majority of virus' are spread via computers sitting in average Joes' living rooms downloading tons of crap from the internet, and populating the embedded virus' through e-mail and what not. (I'm really talking out of my butt here... I have no data to support any of what I just said, nor did I do any reasearch... I'm that lazy :o - It just seems reasonable to me)


I had no idea that several European govts. were switching to Linux. Interesting. I agree, with that happening, attacks on Linux and Linux directed viruses will greatly increase. Let's see if 'open source' proves to be Linux's downfall, or savior...

[Beemer]

It really comes down to the user. The more they know the more secure they can make their box.

[Bio-Hazard]

It really comes down to the user. The more they know the more secure they can make their box.

I'll agree with that comment............ :twisted: Lots and lots of people out there that haven't a clue though.......... :shock:

[silenze]

Ignorant doesn't mean stupid, it just means unaware/unschooled in or (the way I meant it) to deliberately ignore known facts.
If you are truly unaware,of this years string of attacks on Linux :roll: I can't begin to explain them to you.
If you're just ignoring them, that is your choice.
As several European governments switch to Linux platforms, I believe attacks will greatly increase, and the true cost and vulnerability s will become more obvious.
I don't hate Linux (in fact the competition will be very good for MS users price wise as well as forcing MS to deal with some long term problems) however it doesn't make it a panacea.
The challenges (IMHO) Linux faces are
fragmentation- too many proprietary versions which is sure to get worse as branded try to distinguish themselves
Support- cheap/free versions have none,proprietary versions have some but costs will eat them up, and some will end up with abandoned/no longer supported versions.
Cost- often promoted as free, all open-source project must begin to deal with the fact that all of the above mean presenting a viable commercial product is expensive and
support and somehow those costs must be accounted for and payed.

I'm fully aware... I was just making sure you're not one of those people who bash the OS without knowing anything about it.

[silenze]

It really comes down to the user. The more they know the more secure they can make their box.

What it comes down to is... computers needed operators licenses... but then again... look how many MORONS are on the road... guess it wouldn't help. :cry:

[Beemer]

Maybe there should be a test.....
If you score:
>90 = linux
>80 = XP
>70 = 2000
>60 = ME
> 50 = 98
<50 = Mac :lol:

Of course users can hop onto boxes below what they tested for, just not ones above.

[undergroundtech]

Hahaha, you forgot one

<10 = 3.1 :lol:

[Beemer]

Hahaha, you forgot one

<10 = 3.1 :lol:

Can we be that cruel?

[undergroundtech]

Anyone noticing a slight performance hit running SP2?

[silenze]

haha nice

yey I can use em all

<-- 132


I'm running it on my workstation for the moment (SP2) -- no problems/noticeable differences so far..

[undergroundtech]

hrrmm...I've installed SP2 on 3 comps and all of em seem like there averaging about 10 minutes longer to complete my distributed computing projects, sense the update.

Not a big deal really.......OK, Ok.... So I'm lying, its driving me nuts.
After all the time I've spent tweaking the BIOS, disabling windows services, and editing the registry trying to squeeze out that last drop of processing power. Just to install a windows update that ruined weeks of labor.

Is there no justice :x

[Bio-Hazard]

I haven't really noticed anything slowing down. But I stopped folding a while back and the most I do is write a article every now and then, game and surf the net......... :twisted: I can't judge the page load times as I'm on a sat link at the load times suck anyway........... :evil:

[Trunks]

So I read all that but I'm still not sure, should I download Service Pack 2? I just formatted so now would be as good of a time as any.

[silenze]

I've had 0 problems with it around work..

Note: I disable every feature SP2 brings.

[Caj Darkmoon]

I've had 0 problems with it around work..

Note: I disable every feature SP2 brings.

Then uhh... what was the purpose of installing? :)

I still haven't. I'm not hurting when I don't have it... so no need to install it.

[silenze]

I've had 0 problems with it around work..

Note: I disable every feature SP2 brings.

Then uhh... what was the purpose of installing? :)

I still haven't. I'm not hurting when I don't have it... so no need to install it.

There are a lot of fixes Microsoft doesn't release separate from SP2... few of our machines Honda/Acura has required we install it on..

[Trunks]

I trust your judgement silenze I shall install it:p

[silenze]

Anyone with SP2 installed ran into any issues with the Windows Installer service? Mine is set to Automatic yet it fails to start when I try to install/uninstall something now and then... have to start it manually..
annoying..

[fstroupe]

Anyone with SP2 installed ran into any issues with the Windows Installer service? Mine is set to Automatic yet it fails to start when I try to install/uninstall something now and then... have to start it manually..
annoying..

No installer problems here.

[undergroundtech]

No problems yet

[fstroupe]

Actually, after installing SP2 on my two rigs in late July-early Aug, I have only experienced two problems that could possibly be SP2 related....

The problem I had with Windows not recognizing my optical drives was most likely due to glitches in Sims2...probably Sims2 doesn't like SP2.

An online RPG my kids played called "Dark Ages"...in the "add/remove programs" menu, after the line for that software, there was probably a 1.5 foot empty space before the next software line. No other ill effects, but I wouldn't let them keep that game on this rig for fear of other possible glitches.

[silenze]

Actually, after installing SP2 on my two rigs in late July-early Aug, I have only experienced two problems that could possibly be SP2 related....

The problem I had with Windows not recognizing my optical drives was most likely due to glitches in Sims2...probably Sims2 doesn't like SP2.

An online RPG my kids played called "Dark Ages"...in the "add/remove programs" menu, after the line for that software, there was probably a 1.5 foot empty space before the next software line. No other ill effects, but I wouldn't let them keep that game on this rig for fear of other possible glitches.

You could take a peek here.... open up 'regedit' and head to hkey_local_machine\software\microsoft\windows\curr ent version\uninstall

Here are are all the things listed in Add/Remove programs list... I remove things from there from time to time that get screwed up for one reason or another.. just cause I hate seeing the broken crap on the list..

[fstroupe]

Cool info, thanks.