What internet browser do you use?

[techniq]

Was just curious how many of you still use IE.. and what else you may be using in its place. For me, its Firefox/Konq at work (Win2k/Linux boxes) and primarily Konq, although still pull out the firefox on occasion, and is my wife's main browser.

[undergroundtech]

FireFox, but had been using Opera for the previous 3 years

[SlipSand]

Who the hell cares? Its just a web browser you not supposed to be amazed by your browser. It isnt faster.

I use IE.

[techniq]

SlipSand: it might not be faster (although some are, but marginal), but it can be more feature rich. One such thing is tabs, which I can't live without. Spliit screening is very nice, which currently only Konq has as far as I know (great for comparing things, which I used alot in my spanish class to show my assignment in spanish and then in the more easier to read English).

Browsers also have features including popup blocking (firefox is the best at this, IE just got this with SP2 or using a plugin such as the google bar). Firefox also has some nice extensions including mouse-movement shortcuts (what opera is known for originating), storying bookmarks in one location, so you have the same set whether your at work, home, school, mistresses, etc.

[Kattikawn]

Firefox. I got sick of IE when I started dabbling in html and css and found that IE likes to freak out every single time I code another design. I have to design around IE's flaws everytime I want a change.

And despite my general dislike of Macs, I've found the Safari browser to be decent.

[silenze]

FireFox...... I've even uninstalled IE here at home... I ONLY use IE at work when I *HAVE* to.... IE is susceptible to roughly a billion times more spyware/adware/active-x/etc..... I actually recommend AGAINST the use of IE.... GREATLY....... (a big part of this is, I'm sick of cleaning up machines at work that someone has infested with a billion spyware/adware objects, that I have to waste my time getting frustrated and cleaning.)

And yes, some browsers are faster than other's, but the difference is marginal as Techniq mentioned...

Everyone should try Firefox... it looks nicer than IE, I've noticed it to be slightly faster browsing than IE... tabbed browsing owns -- middle-click of the mouse, link opens up in a new, selected tab... and it's pop-up blocking is _the_ best.

If you're going to use IE.... look into 'Spyware Blaster' -- you'll thank me down the road...:)

Random thought; spyware/adware removal tools thread? Might be helpful to some.

[silenze]

Firefox. I got sick of IE when I started dabbling in html and css and found that IE likes to freak out every single time I code another design. I have to design around IE's flaws everytime I want a change.

And despite my general dislike of Macs, I've found the Safari browser to be decent.

I concur.

'Cept I hate Macs with a passion.

[Caj Darkmoon]

Do you know what I'm tired of? The fanboy-ish anti internet explorer crap. People are getting rid of IE and switching to other services just because other people are screaming "IE IS THE DEVIL!" In reality, the only reason IE has the issues it does is because it's the most widely used browser. As use of firefox increases, problems will start to show up there. Honestly, IE is a good browser, its idiots who destroy computers, not that.

[techniq]

Do you know what I'm tired of? The fanboy-ish anti internet explorer crap. People are getting rid of IE and switching to other services just because other people are screaming "IE IS THE DEVIL!" In reality, the only reason IE has the issues it does is because it's the most widely used browser. As use of firefox increases, problems will start to show up there. Honestly, IE is a good browser, its idiots who destroy computers, not that.

Since I am one of those fanboy's, I guess a rebuttal is in order :)

First off, the reason for the IE bashing starts (at least somewhat) from the way it took out the old reigning browser Netscape. IE was a joke in its day, but with a preinstalled and integrated browser available, it didn't take much to chop down Netscape into submission. With IE holding an excessive amount of the market share, it allowed/forced web designers to not give a crap about standards as long as it looked purty in IE, because hey, if it looks good in on there computer, it must everywhere else, and if not, they can just put the *Looks best on IE @ 1024x768 and be done, because you have to have it around.

Now that netscape (err.. gecko engine.. err firefox) is making a strong comeback, you think its because we hate the big man on top. While I admit to do this (but not without at least some backup), this one is hard to be labeled so harsely as such. Agreed that IE/Windows has more vulnerbilities than most others because of its large market share, but because of this they have been able to be *lazy* in many ways. Do you realize that MS hasn't release a major version of IE in over 2 years. Yes, you can call SP2 a major update if you want, but this is only for XP.

As for idiots destroying computers, I agree, but only partially. I actually ran into something that proved some of that wrong. I booted into windows (I'm a linux fanboy 99% of the time) to do something, I forget what, probably photoshop, but while i was in there, I wanted to code something, so I fired up textpad only to get a 'this product is not registered'. Well, like the great citizen I am I went serial hunting, but everywhere I went, I got the lovely "You need this plugin to download, click yes to continue". After sites prompting the, I said what the heck and clicked yes. Let me make clear that I use Windows only for gaming or photoshop and never surf from it, except maybe slashdot or a break from photoshop. Well, after that one Yes button pressed, I had search bars and what coming from all directions. After my best attempt to fight it manually, I pulled out adaware/spy bot/etc, only to detect a few hundred (I think it was 350'ish if I recall), and even after a few runs of each, I still couldn't cleanse it perfectly until I ran through regedit manually, killed some processes, rerunning both apps again, etc.

Ending my rant, abruptly.. Point of the story, competition is GOOD for anything, especially software. Microsoft has been able to buy its way into many markets (how crappy was/is MSN.. now its #2.. because it paid companies like Best Buy 75 dollars for each new subscription (I know this from experience) and programs like Frontpage.. that while may be getting better, really isn't much more functional than Word->Save As->HTML, when compared to Dreamweaver... yes all the 'IT' people think they know HTML because they can wordprocess.

Ok, my train derailed.......... Guess you call that a RANT :)

[undergroundtech]

Do you know what I'm tired of? The fanboy-ish anti internet explorer crap. People are getting rid of IE and switching to other services just because other people are screaming "IE IS THE DEVIL!" In reality, the only reason IE has the issues it does is because it's the most widely used browser. As use of firefox increases, problems will start to show up there. Honestly, IE is a good browser, its idiots who destroy computers, not that.

Your being completely biased, people who have had to work with IE's short comings have been screaming "IE sucks" for years. Only now is the general public STARTING to get a clue. However if all your doing is playing around with the consumer side of IE, I see why you think there is nothing wrong with it, especially if you haven't even tried any other browsers

[silenze]

Your being completely biased, people who have had to work with IE's short comings have been screaming "IE sucks" for years. Only now is the general public STARTING to get a clue. However if all your doing is playing around with the consumer side of IE, I see why you think there is nothing wrong with it, especially if you haven't even tried any other browsers

Amen...

Fanboy-ish? Well as underground tech said, I guess that is a way to look at it from the point of view of someone that has only used IE from a consumer standpoint. I don't recall saying IE is the devil or that it is bad at all, I recall stating the fact that it is much more susceptible to spyware/adware objects and exploits in general...... also that I'm sick of people infesting machines for me to clean up because removing the spyware/adware objects is generally above the 'expertise' of the average computer user, which is sad, because IE is the browser integrated into windows, so Most users just use it... The fact that it is the most widely used browser has little to nothing to do with it being by far the most insecure browser available.... you can thank the developers themselves for that... you may come back with 'but it's the most widely used so most of the crackers/script kiddies/losers/virus writers/ad supporters/spyware affiliates target it', and well, you're 100% right, because they are aware of it's insecurities/flaws.... you would think since it is the most widely used browser, that it would be the most well tested browser, too.... no?

The answer is No, Microsoft sucks -- as Techniq mentioned... 2 Years.........

[SlipSand]

Man...I'd try to stick up for my IE buddy but. They are right. I only use IE because it works. And making fun of people is no way to get good dibs.

[undergroundtech]

Since were on the subject, a 2yr old vulnerability in IE is back.

http://secunia.com/advisories/12765/

Solution:
Disable Active Scripting support.

Use another browser.

[techniq]

Two more things that come to mind with IE that I've ran into is its lack of PNG support (just about _every_ browser but IE supports this, which is a same. PNG uses an alpha mask layer for transparencies, which allowed for smoother edges of full transparenies (hence, no jaggies, compared to a gif, which is either visable or not), as well as partial transparency.

Another IE problem, which caused me great headache, is its disregard to standards. One being the use of the <button> tag. This tag has been in spec for over 4-5 years, but because IE handles it different from spec, noone can use it.

The <button> tag is to replace the <input type="button"> tag as it allows the text on the button to be different from the value passed. For example, you can have


<button name="delete" value="$id">Remove</button>


Which allows you to change the text on the button with the passed values. This is especially handy when you need to pass a reference ID and such... in comparison, you would have to use..


<input type="button" name="delete" value="$id">


This would then do the same thing, but your button would only have a number on it.. which makes it impratical if say you have both an add and delete button, but with the same number.

After I wrote about 500 lines testing in Konq/Firefox, I got to class and fired up IE, only to see nothing happened. I later researched and found somewhere around 5.5 MS decided to change the way they would handle that tag, making it identical to the <input> method (even though you set a value="", it still bases the inner text between the <button></button>.. in this case Remove.

After some thought, I ended up using the input tag, but writing the action and text on the button... such as Delete Page 3... and then using...


$blah = end(split($_GET['delete']))


which grabs the number off the end (php). Ok, just figured I'd backup my critisism of IE, to hopefully break some of the fanboy status :)

More info on the button spec can be found here here (http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/interact/forms.html#h-17.5)

[SlipSand]

If your just looking on the Internet why should you care?
I have made sites but that is useless.

[jurtje]

I used IE all my life and never had a problem with is, I don't make websites so what do I care.


Then I installed Firefox and a whole new world opened up for me. Tabs, better dowload support, bookmark buttons, this browser is the shiznit!


So, for them IE boys, give Firefox a try and you'll see.

[phire]

I've been using IE all my life, but recent mishaps have prompted me to reconsider what browser I'm using..